Jews! Have Christians been believing in a false Messiah for 2000+8 years? ?

Yes they have.


Christians identify Messiah with Jesus and define him as God incarnated as a man, and believe he died for the sins of humanity as a blood sacrifice. This means that one has to accept the idea that one person's death can atone for another person's sins. However, this is opposed to what the Bible says in Deuteronomy 24:26, ';Every man shall be put to death for his own sin,'; which is also expressed in Exodus 32:30-35, and Ezekiel 18. The Christian idea of the messiah also assumes that God wants, and will accept, a human sacrifice. After all, it was either Jesus-the-god who died on the cross, or Jesus-the-human. Jews believe that God cannot die, and so all that Christians are left with in the death of Jesus on the cross, is a human sacrifice. However, in Deuteronomy 12:30-31, God calls human sacrifice an abomination, and something He hates: ';for every abomination to the Eternal, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods.'; All human beings are sons or daughters, and any sacrifice to God of any human being would be something that God would hate. The Christian idea of the messiah consists of ideas that are UnBiblical.


So how have we Jews, who invented the term, always defined the term Messiah?





The Messiah is born of two human parents, as we said.But Jesus, according to Christian theology, was born of a union between a Human woman and God, rather than two HUMAN parents, as was Hercules, and Dionysis, as well as many other pagan gods.


The Messiah can trace his lineage through his human biological father, back to King David (Isaiah 11:1,10; Jeremiah 23:5; Ezekiel 34:23-24; 37:21-28; Jeremiah 30:7-10; 33:14-16; and Hosea 3:4-5). But Jesus's lineage cannot go through his human father, according to Christian theology, as Jesus's father was not Joseph the husband of Mary. According to Christian theology, Jesus's father was God.


The Messiah traces his lineage only through King Solomon (II Samuel 7:12-17; I Chronicles 22:9-10). But according to Luke 3:31, Jesus was a descendant of Nathan, another son of King David, and not a descendant of King David through King Solomon.


The Messiah cannot trace his lineage through Jehoiakim, Jeconiah, or Shealtiel, because this royal line was cursed (I Chronicles 3:15-17; Jeremiah 22:18,30). But according to both Matthew 1:11-12 and Luke 3:27, Jesus was a descendant of Shealtiel.


According to the Jewish definition of the term, the Real Messiah will make changes in the real world, changes that one can see and perceive and be able to prove because these changes take place in the real world. It is for this task that the real messiah has been anointed in the first place, hence the term, messiah -- one who is anointed. These changes, that one will be able to see and perceive in the real world, include:





The Messiah is preceded by Elijah the prophet who, with the Messiah, unifies the family (Malachi 4:5-6), which is contradicted by Jesus in Matthew 10:34-37.


The Messiah re-establishes the Davidic dynasty through the messiah's own children (Daniel 7:13-14). But Jesus had no children.


The Messiah brings an eternal peace between all nations, between all peoples, and between all people (Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-4; Ezekiel 39:9). Obviously there is no peace. Furthermore, Jesus said that his purpose in coming was to bring a sword, and not peace (see Matthew 10:34, as referenced above.)


The Messiah brings about the universal world-wide conversion of all peoples to Judaism, or at least to Ethical Monotheism (Jeremiah 31:31-34; Zechariah 8:23; Isaiah 11:9; Zechariah 14:9,16). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.


The Messiah brings about an end to all forms of idolatry (Zechariah 13:2). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.


The Messiah brings about a universal recognition that the Jewish idea of God is God (Isaiah 11:9). But the world remains steeped in idolatry.


The Messiah leads the world to become vegetarian (Isaiah 11:6-9). It isn't.


The Messiah gathers to Israel, all of the twelve tribes (Ezekiel 36:24). Many of the ten lost tribes remain lost.


The Messiah rebuilds The Temple (Isaiah 2:2; Ezekiel 37:26-28). It hasn't been rebuilt.


There will be no more famine (Ezekiel 36:29-30). People starve to death every day.


After the Messiah comes, death will eventually cease (Isaiah 25:8). People die every day.


Eventually the dead will be resurrected (Isaiah 26:19; Daniel 12:2; Ezekiel 37:12-13; Isaiah 43:5-6);


The nations of the earth will help the Jews, materially (Isaiah 60:5-6; 60:10-12;


The Jews will be sought out for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23);


All weapons will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9,12);


The Nile will run dry (Isaiah 11:15)


Monthly, the trees of Israel will yield their fruit (Ezekiel 47:12);


Each tribe of Israel will receive and settle their inherited land (Ezekiel 47:13-13); Jews! Have Christians been believing in a false Messiah for 2000+8 years? ?
answer: Personally, I think Jesus was meant for the pagan gentiles, not the Jews at all. He was born a Jew but his entire legend proved/proves that he was NOT the Jewish messiah.





Divine birth, miracles, breaking sabbath, not marrying, not being a prophet or teacher, not bringing peace, being a human sacrifice, rising from the dead - all what the Jewish messiah will not be.





But that was perfect for the pagans of that region.





# # #





There are NO Jews who worship Jesus. The majority of ';Jews 4 Jesus'; were never practicing Jews at all. Any Jew who worship Jesus is now an apostate Jew and no longer part of the religion or community - they are now CHRISTIANS.





When you switch from one religion to another - you are no longer part of the former.Jews! Have Christians been believing in a false Messiah for 2000+8 years? ?
From our POV_ sure we think Christians are worshipping a false Messiah. Firstly, the Mashiach is NOT an object of worship, just a person God works his will through, as he did with the prophets in the past, secondly- there is no Messianic age, therefore no Mashiach could have come yet.





Hmm- and why haven't we tried to demystify him? Simple really- the Christians have been in power for most of the last 2000 years and kinda killed Jews who thought to point out that Jesus wasn't the messiah. So, rather than getting killed, the Jews just stayed silent as a matter of self preservation





edit: Ahh- I see the normal Christian organisations fraudently claiming to be Jewish have made their appearance... Jews for Jesus, andMessianic Judaism or whatever other label they concoct for themselves next- are NOT Jewish. No Jewish organisation anywhere recognises them as anything but yet another Christian organisation. The difference between them and other Christians: They deliberately lie and misrepresent themselves in a attempt to convert uneducated Jews.. (Note- when they have tried to go to court in an attempt to force the issue and tp be allowed to use Jewish cemetaries and other facilities- the Jewish communities have won everytime, with the courts recognising that it is Jews who define Judaism- not Christian organisations pretending to be Jewish!)
Well, we kind of think so. But, shhhh, they seem SO HAPPY with him. Let them enjoy. For all you know -- we're right in our religion for us, AND their right in their religion for them.





Actually I do have a theory about this, but I also have car grease all over myself so I'll see if I can get make later to add it.





Seriously Judaism's job was to bring morality concepts into the world %26amp; to do Tikkum Olam, repair of the world, as best we can, not tell everyone else how to practice their beliefs.





===============


Wassu


No, those were Christians who were lying about being Christian. Pretty insulting to both religions. Also, they call themselves Jews as a manipulative tactic to make it easier to convert Jews. Lying, manipulation, %26amp; stealing other religion's identity -- is not cool. Oh, %26amp; then they play the ';victim'; about it. Mostly, Jews have had so much taken from us - our belongings, our countries we were living in, our lives -- now their taking our very religious identity %26amp; trying to convert us enmass without our consent that way. Sigh.
In my opinion, Christians are mistaken in worshipping a Jewish man as God (or any other deity, for that matter). However, it's not my job to tell other people what to believe, and Jesus taught some basic principles of Judaism, so it's not a completely bad thing.
If Jewish people didn't believe that Christianity honors a false messiah, they wouldn't be Jewish; they'd be Christian.





This is a good site explaining why Jews aren't Christians:


http://www.messiahtruth.com/response.htm鈥?/a>





A few quotes from the above site:


';Judaism, unlike the Christianity, does not believe that the Messiah is Jesus. The noun moshiach (translated as messiah) annotatively means 'annointed one;' it does not, however, imply 'savior.' The notion of an innocent, semi-divine being who will sacrifice himself to save us from the consequences of our own sins is a purely Christian concept that has no basis in Jewish thought or scripture.





';In Judaic texts, the term messiah was used for all kings, high priests, certain warriors, but never eschatological figures. In the Tanach, moshiach is used 38 times: two patriarchs, six high priests, once for Cyrus, 29 Israelite kings such as Saul and David. Not once is the word moshiach used in reference to the awaited Messiah. Even in the apocalyptic book of Daniel, the only time moshiach is mentioned is in connection to a murdered high priest. The Dead Sea Scrolls, the Pseudepigrapha, and Apocrypha never mention the Messiah.





';The man destined to be the Messiah will be a direct descendant of King David (Isaiah 11:1) through the family of Solomon, David's son (1 Chronicles 22:9-l0). He will cause all the world to serve God together (Isaiah 11:2), be wiser than Solomon (Mishnah Torah Repentance 9:2), greater than the patriarchs and prophets (Aggadah Genesis 67), and more honored than kings (Mishnah Sanhedrin 10), for he will reign as king of the world (Pirkei Eliezer).'; ....
I would suggest that Jesus is the Christian 'messiah'. But no, he wasn't the Jewish one.





Far too many Christians seem to overlook that the very concept OF 'messiah' is a JEWISH one. Jews thought of it. Jews wrote about it. Jews defined 'maschiach'. So for Christianity to come along, totally REvise the concept and THEN spend 2000 yrs + driving us Jews CRAZY about how we 'rejected' our 'saviour' and we're 'ignorant' etc, is really absurd.





Judaism has always been clear on its idea of 'maschiach'. The Jewish messiah is just an ordinary Jewish man, he is not 'divine' and he has no 'supernatural' powers; he won't be walking on water or performing miracles. Rather, he will epitomise the best in honour and integrity. And to even qualify as the maschiach, he must fulfill all the Jewish messianic prophecies. Every single one. And he must do it *before* he dies. There is no 'second coming' for the Jewish Maschiach.





Christianity, meanwhile, says something very different. Jesus is portrayed as a part divine 'son of god' who died in order to carry the sins of the rest of mankind. He is 'god incarnate', part of the 'trinity' and, according to many Christians, it is only by accepting Christ that any human can connect with G-d and reach 'heaven'.





Thus we have, effectively, two entirely different messiahs.





And neither religion is going to change its view. Jesus can never be the Jewish messiah: he didn't fulfill any of the Jewish messianic prophecies before he died. And Jesus will always be the Christian messiah; the entire religion is predicated upon his being precisely that.





What, then, are the Jewish messianic prophecies? They are as follows, and it is empirical *fact* that nobody has yet fulfilled them:











* He will be descended from King David (Isaiah 11:1) via King Solomon (1 Chron. 22:8-10)





*The Moshiach will be a man of this world, an observant Jew with ';fear of God'; (Isaiah 11:2)





*Evil and tyranny will not be able to stand before his leadership (Isaiah 11:4)








* There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease (Isaiah 25:8)








* All of the dead will rise again (Isaiah 26:19)








* The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness (Isaiah 51:11)








* He will be a messenger of peace (Isaiah 52:7)








* The ruined cities of Israel will be restored (Ezekiel 16:55)








* Weapons of war will be destroyed (Ezekiel 39:9)








* The Temple will be rebuilt (Ezekiel 40) resuming many of the suspended mitzvot.








*He will then perfect the entire world to serve God together (Zephaniah 3:9)








*Jews will know the Torah without Study (Jeremiah 31:33)








* He will give you all the desires of your heart (Psalms 37:4)








* He will take the barren land and make it abundant and fruitful (Isaiah 51:3, Amos 9:13-15, Ezekiel 36:29-30, Isaiah 11:6-9).








* Once he is King, leaders of other nations will look to him for guidance. (Isaiah 2:4)











* The whole world will worship the One God of Israel (Isaiah 2:17)








* The peoples of the world will turn to the Jews for spiritual guidance (Zechariah 8:23)





* Nations will end up recognizing the wrongs they did to Israel (Isaiah 52:13-53:5)


* He will include and attract people from all cultures and nations (Isaiah 11:10) .





* Knowledge of God will fill the world (Isaiah 11:9)





*The Sanhedrin will be re-established (Isaiah 1:26)*





*All Israelites will be returned to their homeland (Isaiah 11:12)








--------------------------------------鈥?br>




The Christian Evangelical Cult that calls itself Messianic 'judaism' is just that: Christian. All the members are devout Christians. There is no 'messianic' sect IN Judaism. Messianics = Christians.





'jews4jesus' was founded by an ordained BAPTIST minister. Since when do BAPTISTS get to rewrite Jewish beliefs? This, again, is a Christian group, as its founder openly ADMITS.





Christians don't get to unilaterally decide that worshipping Christ is part of Judaism. It isn't. It never was. It never will be.





There's no debate. Jewish belief is not 'flexible'. SOME Christians may not like it - but so what? Since when do Jews need CHRISTIAN approval to practise Judaism?
Look, it's not our buisness to intervene in your religious affairs.





Let's leave it at that.
Sure. You see, messiah is a Hebrew word and the Jews know exactly what it means.





Christians don't.
Math is a little off. It would be closer to 1978 years.
Jesus was born in AD 4. Christianity didn't start until he was risen from the dead which would have been AD 37. No, we haven't believed in a false Messiah. But the Jews mostly have not believed in him because they were told lies about it and believed and accepted the lies. So, they are the ones in trouble.
No, I met many Jews who believe Jesus is the Messiah when I traveled through Israel. They call Him Yeshua. They do not call themselves Christians but Messianic Jews. They are of the most persecuted people on the planet, hated for being both Christian and Jewish.





Here's an old geocities page I did in college:





http://www.geocities.com/jnicklas_99/Jes鈥?/a>





Also know that all of Jesus disciples were tortured to death for claiming to have seen him risen from the dead. Maybe a few of them could have kept their story straight under torture if they were liars or crazy, but the fact that all of them kept the same story under horrible torture is compelling evidence to believe in the resurrection.





Jews are great evidence for God. Think of everything they've been through, living in exile, persecuted around the world, returning to Israel and finally to Jerusalem. And then think about how all of these things were prophesied before they happened in great detail.
Au contraire, mon ami! A lot has been said on both sides of the argument. There are at least 2 large religious organizations which are Jewish, wherein, there is a tenet that Jews missed the boat and that they should accept Jesus as the Messiah. These are The Messianic Jew and Jews For Jesus. The organizations are actively politicking amongst Jews to bring them into the fold, so-to-speak. Only last week, a Jewish man called me because I had expressed interest in Jews for Jesus. He wanted me to attend one of his many lectures in cities in the Niagara Peninsula where the synagogues have failed and the Jews have either given up their Judaism or moved to the bigger cities where there are still struggling Synagogues. My ex-wife became a Jews for Jesus person when we got divorced over 30 years ago and wears both a golden cross and a golden star of David. They have prescribed ceremonies and celebrations for both Moses and Jesus, who by the way are in the same line of ancestry from Moab, the illigitimate son of Lot by an adolescent daughter following the pillar of salt story of Lot's wife. In the New Testament, there's a story of Jesus' concession that he is related to Moses when they both appear red-faced as if they have spoken to God directly, which the biblical story confirms. The many Jews who spoke against Jesus as the Messiah were the ones directly responsible for the persecution and death of Jesus. This is described in all the Gospels of John, Luke and Matthew and is played over and over again at Christmas time in the Passion Plays. In the face of the overwhelming success of the Christians and the lack of successes of the Jews, just in terms of population numbers and land, de-mystifying Jesus is an almost impossible task. Even Christians admit that Jesus was a Jewish man as well as being the Son of God. Unfortunately, the Popes encouraged their flocks to think of the Jews as Jesus killers, a still prominent notion. I've been called a Jesus killer as recently as last month when I started a discussion with a Russian Orthodox Catholic Lady, born and living in Canada. I was beaten up frequently as a Jew living in a non-Jewish area in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada, derided as a Jesus killer by my classmates and neighbours. Since World War II, the antisemitic feelings of Christians and Moslems for Jews has waxed and waned and is now stronger than ever. Jews and Negroes, who should be shoulder to shoulder because of oppression, and once were, are now antagonist mainly because of the Jewish-Moslem conflicts which are worsening. Ironically, Isaac was the patriarch of all Jews and Ishmael was the patriarch of all Muslims. They were half-brothers and were at odds because of the Commandments, both in Judaism and Mohammedism. If they but kissed and made up as sons of Ibrahim/Abraham, the grand patriarch of them both, Sarah and Hagar being the separate mothers. If they understood the blood relationship and it's strength and forgave the father for making an uneven distribution of his property and promised lands, the Middle Eastern conflict of over 3000 years would be resolved and we could all go back to the comfort of our homes and families. No, my friend, a LOT has been said and there's been a lot of water under the bridge since the original events of Jesus' birth and crucifixion, and the traditions and bloody conflicts of Jews, Christians and Muslims.
the Holy Words of God Most High Christ Jesus, the One True Living God affirms, the Jew will someday will see and recognized Him in His coming!





Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,


Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.


Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and %26gt;%26gt;they also which pierced him%26lt;%26lt;: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.






mr. Snuffaluffagus in jewish.
The jews killed jesus and he didn't rise from the dead, end of story.